Episode Transcript
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of Cup of Nukes. As always, I'm your host, Mr. Whiskey, and we are continuing with our Tampa Frontline Tasting series, another in-person podcast. So excited for this opportunity. Again, thank you to Mike Waskiewicz and everyone at Craft, you know, doing this and putting this together. I know it was not easy, and it's been so exciting to have a dedicated space for in-person interviews, to meet with the veteran brand owners and to see their products, handle their products, hear their passion and craft for it. And so here with Mr. Scott Jenkins- Mm-hmm ... to explore what he's doing here and his life story, and we're gonna get into a whole bunch of stories as- Yep as he's warned me with beforehand. So super excited to get into it. So Mr. Jenkins- Yes ... thank you for being here. No, thanks for having me. I'm excited to be here. Yeah. Yeah. I'd love to know what brought you to this particular event in Tampa. So I met Mike, a year or two ago for his bar book project he does. Right. Right. And so he reached out to us to do samples of our gin- Mm ... for his bar book. And I was excited about it 'cause we were pretty new into that area and we wanted to get promotional material, and so he did such a nice job for it. So when he told us about this event, he said, "So do you have... Are you ex-military? Do you have any relationship with the military?" 'Cause he wanted me to come down and be part of it. And I said, "Well, I am not ex-military, but both my sons are veterans." He said, "That's good. Then you're military adjacent." So- Right ... so I have a son that's just got out of the Navy after eight years. My other son was in the Air Force. Both of them are aircraft mechanics. Okay. And so they're both now working at the distillery. So because of that, he invited us, and he was so nice to us with the bar book and everything, I wanted to pay it back. Right. So I thought, if I can come down and support him and the military, 'cause I'm not a veteran, but I feel strong about veterans Right I wanted to pay it back however I could, so that's what got me down here. Right. And luckily for you and your sons, you know, aircraft mechanics, and barrels, and pipes, and all that stuff- Oh, yes ... it's all the same stuff I think. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Trust me. It's like- Jet fuel and bourbon are the same ... Yes. Yes. Like, go weld this up. Go solder this up. Yeah. Go fix this. Go fix that. Well, a bad bourbon might taste like jet fuel too. It could. It could. Yes, it could. So let's get a little bit of your backstory, though, back when, you know, you were probably your son's age, you know. Yes. Going back to that, what kind of were you doing in life? What kind of set you off post-high school career-wise? So I've always been on the manufacturing side. Mm. So I've done everything under the sun over the years. So I've actually have a degree in economics. Okay. And so I got into manufacturing 'cause that's something I love is how to produce things. So I took my economics background and applied it to manufacturing. And so I start looking at systems and processes and how they all work. And then over the years, I've worked for large companies and small companies, but it's always looking at how processes are done, how can you grow a company? How can you make it more efficient? How do you change the cultures and all that? I've always was looking for something I could do for myself, and I never really found the right thing, but I was- I don't know, 10 years ago or so, I'm in Louisville, Kentucky, that's where our distillery's at Okay. So the Bourbon Trail was amazing, and there's so many bourbon distilleries everywhere. I kinda got- Mm ... the bug for producing- Right ... alcohol from that. But there are so many good bourbons. There's so much bourbon out there, I didn't feel like I could contribute anything that would make a difference. I couldn't- Mm break into the market, I didn't think. And it's like, if I'm gonna do something, I wanna do something I can elevate, make a difference- Right ... and change something. I thought gin, not because of my last name, but I thought gin was that item that I could produce- Mm ... I can take it and make it a world-class product- Mm and make a difference, right? So, 'cause there's not a lot of gin in Kentucky. There's some- Right ... but not a lot, not compared to bourbon at least. Yeah. And so that's how I got started going down that path. So once I made that decision to do gin, I started looking... 'Cause I'm all about education. Mm. I don't care what you're doing in life, you need to get educated. I don't care if you're gonna be a bricklayer or a professor or anything in between. You- Underwater basket weaving ... yeah, I don't care. You wanna be the best at it, and you need to know your job and learn to become a professional, right? Yes, sir. And be the best you can be. So I started looking for who has programs in distilling- Mm specifically for gin, if it's available. Mm-hmm. And I found one college in the UK that actually has a distilling program. Mm. And COVID hit the same time, so then it was all online classes, 'cause you couldn't go anywhere. Right. And so I dug into, it's Heriot-Watt out of Edinburgh, which- Mm ... I've been to the campus, I've been to Edinburgh and seen everything, but the classes actually were online. Mm. So I spent a couple years doing all that and getting that done. So once I've got that framework- around things. I knew kind of what I was doing. Then it's like, let's start working on a product. Let's figure out how we can make- Mm ... take that and now turn into something. So we started experimenting. We took the knowledge we had to come up with some core botanicals, core formulas, and then I started looking at processes. I wanted a gin that was bold- Mm ... not high flight, not high alcohol- Mm ... strong flavors. Right. But I wanted something that played well together. Everybody has had bad gin or think they don't like gin- For sure ... it's because they've had gin that has too much juniper in it and not enough of anything else. Mm. So the juniper overpowers them, and they all complain it tastes like pine needles, right? I've heard that before, so. So, and it's like we ... So the idea, we have to break that. We have to come up with a gin that actually has botanicals in it. So our gin has nine botanicals. Wow. So this particular gin is our first release. Mm. It's called Louisville Dry Gin because we're in Louisville, and it's a typical London dry type. Mm. And dry means you don't add anything to it after distillation except for water. Mm. So our gins are also 100% natural, because once it comes off the still- Right ... we add water. We let it rest for a few weeks because it's still... Even though it's done, it's still not done because it's still working. Yes, sir. And then we then we bottle it. But to get that to where it needed to be at, we started looking at what is the process for making gin? What alcohol do we put it in? Because we let ours marinate for about 24 hours before we distill it. What proof alcohol does it need to marinate at to get the most flavors out of the botanicals? Mm. Because what you're doing is you're pulling essential oils out of the botanicals. Mm-hmm. And to get those oils out, you got... That's what the alcohol does. It pulls all that- Right ... out into the alcohol. So what, what proof is the sweet spot for doing that? Mm. Mm. Then it's like, what temperatures do you distill at? Does... You want, you want to distill fast? You run it slow? What... Again, what maximizes the flavor getting into the alcohol? Because if... It's like, with florals, you can't distill those because you'll lose all the flavors with distillation. Mm. That's a different process. So this is a citrus forward. So we went through all the process and then come up with something, and then at that point, we start testing with everybody. So all the friends and family come over, everybody that's in there that we know- Right ... come over and try this one, try that one, tell me which one's better, right? And be honest about it. And be honest about it. Don't hurt my feelings, please. You know? And so we went through all those and got everything done. And so I'm a gin and tonic person. I love gin and tonic. So the first hurdle was it has to make a great gin and tonic, right? Right, right. So, 'cause if it, if I can't, I couldn't... If I'm not gonna drink it, I'm not gonna sell it, right? Very fair. So. So we got that all worked out, and then, at that point, we had a product we thought we were ready for. And then the next step was build the distillery. And so in 2022, still during COVID, I found a location, and we started building a distillery. It's a small distillery, but... And it's not for, it's not for show, it's just for production. But that got us started. Now we've got a distributor in Kentucky. We're getting on shelves in Kentucky. So this year's all about building out the brand and getting on the shelves, and then next year we'll start looking at what other states to transition to, and then start growing from there. Now, I, we also have this other bottle here for anyone watching. Now, what's the difference between this one and the one you showed previously? Yeah. So that bottle is not a London dry-type gin. Mm. So when it comes off the still, so we make a base gin, and again, it's 100% natural. Right. Right. There's not There's nothing added to it, no sugars, no dyes, nothing. Good. Good. So the yellow color is coming from the ... It's made with elderflower. Mm. It's a floral gin. Mm. And so the alcohol is pulling those colors out of the flowers. So with like gins that are rose petal or any other kind of floral like that with flowers- Right you cannot distill those. The, it- Mm ... it strips all those flavors away, so you have to let those flavors marinate in the alcohol. So with this one, the Golden Bloom has seven botanicals in it. So five are traditional gin, like juniper- Mm ... coriander, cardamom, those types. Right. But then we add, elderflower and a little bit of orange peel. Mm. Just a little bit. And then we put that into a barrel, and we let the elderflower marinate in the alcohol- Mm ... for about half a day, and that pulls all those flavors and colors out, and it turns it a real pretty golden. Mm. And that's why we call it Golden Bloom. I love everything you're talking about, because so many people who have never taken the time to sit down and read the ingredients or to talk to the experts- Yeah people don't realize, like it is a craft. Like- Yes ... you are, I would say, daresay a florist as much as you are- As much as anything, yes ... like ... Right. And people don't realize all the ingredients. Like, some people who are more into it might say, "Oh, yeah, there's rye and barley and wheat and corn and stuff." You don't think about all this stuff. Right. A lot of people just think, "Oh, you, you throw in some syrup," you know? Exactly. And, and some- Exactly. Yeah ... and some companies do that. Mm-hmm. But you're talking about when you're doing it all natural, and people don't realize, right? It's not like you're just dissolving flowers into it. Like, there's a process to it. Yes. And you already had a background on the manufacturing side, right? Right. And that, that made a big difference, huge difference- Mm ... on this. So, so it's like ... 'Cause I've always approached things systematically and look at- Right ... processes, right? So it's like ... And that's what makes this repeatable. So- Mm ... 10 years from now, if you try this, it's still gonna taste the same, 'cause it's a very specific process we follow- Right ... that's documented to make sure we get consistent results every time. Yeah. Our flavors won't be changing in time. But you're right. It to me always look like, it's like a chef, right? Yeah. You gotta know what flavors and how things play well together, right? Of course. Because certain things don't play well together. Mm-hmm. And that's why our Golden Bloom has orange peel only, and our London Dry has cinnamon and nutmeg, 'cause cinnamon and nutmeg help accentuate the other- Mm ... flavors in it. And our goal with all of our products is not... I- is to make a gin that's very balanced and very smooth, so you're not overpowered with juniper. You have something that you can actually enjoy and drink. So, like, I have a lot of people that just sip our gins, which is a new thing for me. I never knew that was a thing. But I have a lot of bourbon drinkers that love our gin. Mm-hmm. So we have a third product that's a limited release- Mm ... that has a lot of cinnamon and nutmeg in it, so it has a little bit of kick and a burn to it. Okay. And they love it because they can sit in their backyard or wherever and enjoy it- Okay and just sip on it. 'Cause- While listening to this podcast. Oh, they better be. Hopefully. They better be. Yeah. And what I love about this too, you've talked about processes and, you know, I'm a nuclear operator, so I'm all about that stuff as well. Yeah. Yeah. And when it comes to this, you're not a magician who just you grab a couple of things, threw it together, right? Yeah. How much trial and error went on behind the scenes? Years? Months? Weeks? How did you go about calculating, "I'm gonna try this. I'm gonna add this." Yes. The research, the study. Yeah. Like, people don't see that, so I'd love to hear about that. Well, and again, it's like, first step is know your craft, right? Right. So you know what you're doing, and knowing what you're driving toward, right? Right. And so when we developed our first product, I knew what we wanted to get out of it and what our goal was. Mm. But then it's like, how do we get there? So I got probably 75% of the way there based on the knowledge I gathered at school- Uh-huh and all that, but then it's like, okay, let's go back. Let's make a few batches. Okay. Let's change a few things. Let's up, change the botanicals a little bit. And it's then it's a scientific method. Right. You change one thing, and then you test it- Right ... and see which one's better, and you pick one and move on. Right. Right? And you had a few where you sipped it, your face cringed, and you're like, "Ooh, let's never make that again," right? Exactly. Exactly. That's part of it. That's the one we break out for neighbors we don't like. Exactly. You know? Well, and that's a good point. They're gonna sit on the reserve. Well, and that's part of what we're trying to do, right? So it's like- Our tagline is, "We build connections, you pour it forward." Right? Ooh, I love that. And so Our goal with Ar-Gen is we wanna do a high-class product that you wanna give to your friends. Mm. Right? If you're gonna have family over or you're gonna have your friends over, and you wanna give them the good stuff, I want that good stuff to be us. Right. So that was our idea. So we've crafted the product and everything on the bottle, everything's done with intention, right? Mm-hmm. So for example, we have nine botanicals in our bottle, and they're all listed right here. So you can see everything that's in here, all of our botanicals. That's good. But every botanical has a symbol assigned to it. Mm. And so we use those symbols to decorate our bottle- Wow ... like this, right? I love that. And the idea is it's like a quilt. Mm. And so for our thought process behind that, it's like, because we're from Kentucky, quilts are real popular there. Yeah. And I know they're popular in other places, too, but we wanted something... 'cause a quilt kind of represents us as a brand. Right. Because it's, it's, it, it's- The connection ... there's connections, there's, it's heritage involved. You know? Mm. It's something that wraps you and keeps you warm. You know, there's so many things that connects with- Right a quilt, and those same thing apply to us. You have a whole bunch of individual patches of cloth- Right ... but when you put them all together, they make something more than the individual patches, right? Right. And that's the idea with the botanicals. Yeah. Each botanical is so-so by itself, but when you bring them all together, it's like cooking, right? You bring all the right botanical together, then you cook them the right way- Right ... you get something more than the individual parts. It brings everything and l- real- elevates everything. Right. Yeah. So that was the idea with all that. Now, do you have any recipes you're working on right now for a new release, or are you kind of... 'Cause you mentioned, like, 2021, 2022. Yes. It's pretty recent. Yeah. Especially in the world of distilling and stuff- Right ... that's a little blip. But- Yeah ... how has everything been so far? Successes, failures, unexpected hardships. How has that journey been? So the good and negative of it is it's very difficult, 'cause it's like getting the distillery built. I thought that well, first I thought getting the formula at a high grade would be the hardest part. Mm-hmm. We got that done. So then it's like, okay, we got that done, now we gotta build a distillery. I thought that was gonna be the hard part. And we got that done. Then it's like, now we gotta find a distributor. And then I thought, "Well, that's gonna be a hard part." Every step along we've been very- Right ... challenging, let's say. Mm. And I would tell anybody getting into this business- Right ... is perseverance. Mm. You have to be dedicated to what you're doing, and you have to love what you're doing. Mm-hmm. And you have to stick with it when it gets tough, 'cause it's gonna get tough, and it's gonna take time. 'Cause everything I've done has taken twice as long what I thought it should've taken. Mm. But we're getting there. Every year we do better. Our sales are going up. Everything's moving forward. But you just gotta keep pushing. So it has been a challenge. Right. But it's also been a lot of fun, too, 'cause you meet a lot of people. It's like meeting you today, right? Right. You meet a lot of people you wouldn't have met otherwise. You go other, do things you wouldn't normally do. And so it's all been positive and fun, too. So it's like there's pluses and minuses with all of them. But the main thing is you just gotta stick with it and persevere, 'cause it is a challenge. Now, the other side of it is that keeps a lot of people out of it that probably shouldn't be in it- Right ... anyway, 'cause if you don't love this, doing this- You shouldn't be doing it. Yeah. You need to go find the thing that you love to do. And that's been the theme of the day. The more I interview all the, the owners here who make these products, you know, I'm thinking now of how many products almost existed and then they quit because, hearing how difficult it is- Yes , And we know there's plenty of people who have this idea, "Oh, I'm gonna make my own line of alcohol, and it's gonna be easy." And they're not ready for that challenge and so they leave. Yes. I've talked about it in the podcasting industry. People say, "Oh, I'm gonna make a podcast. I'm gonna make $40,000 a month, get all these- Good luck listeners." And they start it, and they're like, "Hey, this takes consistency- Yeah ... commitment, going through the hardships." And it's any entrepreneur, you know, will tell you- Mm ... the same thing. And so really that's been the theme for all the interviews today. But also it just has me thinking how many gins almost existed and didn't because someone gave up, and it's really mind-blowing to think about that. Oh, yeah. But what you find is the people who do stay with it are, are some of the most passionate and dedicated people you'll meet. Well, it's just like what you said with podcasts. You have to persevere. But you have to believe in yourself. Yeah. You know, that's the thing. If you truly believe in what you're doing and you believe in yourself you can accomplish anything, right? Mm. So it's like you gotta have the faith, and you gotta have the belief, and you gotta just be hardheaded enough to stick with it. It's like this formula, this recipe will be successful. It's just the means of getting to it distributed and for people to recognize- Yes ... it. Absolutely. And that's one of the most difficult things is when you can recognize the worth of what you're creating, but others can't. You know, my show- Right ... is called A Couple of Newbs 'cause it was supposed to be a couple of us hosting, and I was the only one who believed in the idea. Right. And I ended up doing it by myself because other people didn't see it. And then these are the same people,, and maybe you could talk to, who said it wasn't gonna go anywhere or this or that. They'll come back around once you have it. Oh, absolutely. "Oh, I see you made that gin. I'd love to partner up." And it's like, I... But months ago you said, "Oh, this isn't going anywhere- Right ... when I needed your help." Now, now that we've launched it and people are bringing it to Tampa, Florida for tastings, now you wanna partner up all of a sudden. Exactly. Well, it's like everybody- And that's how it gets- When I first started, everybody's like, "Oh, is this a hobby you're doing in the garage?" No, this is a business. And it's like I said, this is, this is It has my name on the label. It has to be a world-class product, right? Right. If I can't make something that I'm worth, that I feel good about putting my name on, then why do it? Right. And so you have to believe in it, and it's like... And there are hardships along the way, and there's a lot of experimentation, but once you get that part down, now it's just working the market. So we, we only have three products- Mm-hmm ... back to your original question. Right. We have others we might do in the future- Mm but it's like right now I have three really solid, really good products. Mm. So our third product, which we haven't really... we did a limited release of it so far. It's called Heritage Reserve. Okay. And it's, uh, very, very smooth, very, very high-end. It's got a whole lot of cinnamon and nutmeg in it, so it has a nice little burn to it, so bourbon drinkers love it. Yeah. And I tell people, "If you're gonna make a cocktail, use one of our other ones, but if you're just gonna sit and enjoy it and sip it, this is the one for you." Right. Right? And So I've got citrus, I got floral, and then I got a sipping gin. So I've got all the real bases- Mm covered, and, and I'd rather make a great- traditional gin than do a novelty. So I'm not looking to do things just to do them just- Right. Right ... because people are talking about it at the moment. Right. Now, if I think it's... because I've heard a lot of people say, "Why don't you do this," and, "Why don't you do that?" And it's like, well- Mm ... that's the flavor of the moment. I'm looking for the long term. I wanna be here- Right ... 50 years from now. Yeah. Long after I'm gone. Right. Both of my kids are involved, so they can- Right ... run with it. But- And they've got kids helping out too. Exactly. Hopefully. Well, and I think- You know? ... something you just mentioned that came to mind is there's a difference between I'm proud because my name is on it, and my name is on it because I'm proud of it, you know? Exactly. And like, I think- Exactly ... some people wanna just make the product to say, "I made a product," rather than, "Hey, I made a product because I want it to do X, Y, Z." Exactly. A, B. And I think one thing too is people stretch their bandwidth too thin saying, "Okay, I made this, I made this. Now I'm gonna make this, this, this." And then- Yeah. I think, I, I totally agree ... you never properly launch- Yeah ... and stuff. 'Cause I've interviewed a couple brand owners today, and it can be a challenge getting into the market. Yeah. You know, slowly building your way, and we talked earlier, on my first podcast, about seasonal sensitivity. Uh-huh. Some people are like, "Hey, it's not the right season." Other people are saying, "Hey, why should I choose your product over what I already have?" Right. You know? And have you found an edge to your stuff because a lot of people don't have botanical gins that you can just drink straight. A lot of people use them as mixers. Has that given you kind of a competitive edge into getting into places? It does. So one, because we are in Kentucky only right now- Mm-hmm being local is a very big competitive edge, 'cause everybody loves buying local. Right. So that gets us in a few places. Mm-hmm. The fact that it's the quality that it is, and- Mm-hmm ... and once you give it to people to try it, so we do a lot of tastings. It's like every time we tend to do a tasting we tend to sell out of whatever product at whatever liquor store we're in. Right. So they... we've basically, in three hours we'll sell all their product. Because right now a lot of people don't know us. We're still getting out there. But once we get in, it's like we, we got in Liquor Barn, we've gotten in Total Wine, we've got into some big chains- Nice ... just because of the, like you say, the quality. Mm. So it all works to our favor, it's just working it, right? Right. So we just gotta keep on promoting it, working events, working things. That's one of the reasons we're here with you, right? Right. I'm excited about craft, and you're part of it, and I wanted to support you too. Right. But at the same time it also helps us- Promote our gin. So it's, it's a win-win Yeah. And I know me personally, like for my neighbors that I buy bottles of alcohol for Christmas or holidays or whatever, you know, it's gonna be all these brands, right? Right. Because I know your story, and I'd rather contribute to y'all than to these big name brands. That's nothing personal against Jack Daniels or, or whoever, Malat- Right ... or whatever, right? They- I agree ... they have great products. Yeah. Their products are amazing, that's why they've been in the top for a while. But I love like Mike Waskiewicz and I, when I interviewed him- Sure ... he talked about, come on, like if we got all the military stores to have a veteran-owned shelf- Yes what an impact that... That would change your life, and it wouldn't really change Jack Daniel's life if- No. Exactly. That's a huge impact for us, right? And that's why I always, like you said, buy local or I support those connections and stuff. Yes. When I buy products, I always try to get it through my podcast guests or people I've met at these events. Because, you know, sure, I could go to any, you know, store and get the big brand name, but it makes such a bigger impact for y'all. Right. And so that's why for, these gins will probably be in my neighbor's house for Christmas, um- There you go ... but if you're watching this, they're not gonna be. They are. You know, I just, it's, it's a surprise. Yes. One of y'all is getting Golden Bloom and the other's gonna get the other one. I'm not gonna tell you who's getting what, that way you can still be surprised. There you go. Yeah. There you go. As promised. But it is, I think it's a great thing, you know? And I lo- there's nothing better than for me, like you talked about the sharing, when I try an alcohol, I'm like, "You know what? I know who would love this." Exactly. I think that's beautiful. It's just like when you try a restaurant, you're like, "Oh, I gotta bring my friends here because it's a great spot." I think it's beautiful and that's with networking in general. Right. So. No, yeah, absolutely. And that's, so our gin is like- And that's what we made it for. It's like something you wanna share. You know, something you- Mm-hmm ... wanna give to your friends and neighbors, right? Yeah. And I get... Now that I'm in this industry, I get so much alcohol for Christmas and New Years. People buying me all kinds of stuff, you know? And it's like, that's all great, but it's like, just make sure you're buying the things that are worth giving. Like, if these- Mm ... are people that you care about- Yeah ... and that are important to you, then give them things. I'd rather just spend time with people, you know? Mm-hmm. You don't have to buy me anything. Yeah. But if you're gonna buy me something, that's, that's nice, too. Yeah. And that's what this is really... that's the kind of things we've developed this for, things you wanna share. You know, either share it with a cocktail, share it with a drink, or share it with a gift bottle or whatever. 100%. Yeah. Yeah. And thank you along the lines of sharing, for sharing your time today- Oh, thank you for having us ... for coming down here to Tampa and to highlight these products, and hopefully we'll get some samples later on- Yeah, yeah to try it out. For sure. And, I just appreciate what you're doing, you know? And I'm very grateful for the opportunity to be here, because I think a lot of people have never looked at a bottle and thought, "What's the story behind it?" Or taken- Yeah ... the time to read the ingredients or the details of, like, the quilting, you know? Right. That, that stuff is so beautiful, and most people don't take the time. And all this hustle culture and move faster and do this, people don't take the time to... I don't wanna sound cliche, but to slow down and smell the roses, so to speak. Well, that's just it. I mean- Or to smell the botanicals. Well, like, everybody at this event, all these brands, they're all craft. That means somebody's out there working really hard to develop something- Yeah ... that they can share with other people. It's like, my name is not on it, like you said- Mm-hmm ... 'cause I, I would rather... This is not my wheelhouse. I'm not real comfortable doing podcasts. I'd rather be back there making gin, right? Right. Right. That's my wheelhouse, hiding behind the curtain. Mm-hmm. But you have to do what you have to do. But all these people are out there doing it, so these are- Yeah ... not huge Jim Beams and- Yeah ... Maker's Marks, right? They're all small craft distilleries, so they're all- Right ... and they all putting their blood and sweat into it, so it's like, it's ni- I like what you said. It's like, appreciate all the work that they've put into it- Yeah ... to get this where it's at. And I... That's why I love this conversation, because I can go to the store now or to other events and understand how much work goes into it. Yes. And it, it really shifts your perspective. And even with, like, the cigar guys- Yes ... knowing how much dedication goes into picking the, the balancing of the flavors and the wrappers and all that stuff. Like, people, we just take everything for granted nowadays. Everything's just already made and It's all mass-produced Right. Right. And you, you forget that somewhere along the way, there's some guy in a back room figuring out all this stuff. Yeah. Yeah, 100%. So thank you for shedding light on that and for guesting today. Oh, thank you. No, I'm just glad to have this, so thank you for having us.
